So, in an apparent display of of I Love My Guns More Than You, the Wisconsin GOPers are making sure that guns are part of daily life inside their capitol building, voting to allow concealed carry on the legislative floor and in the visitor’s gallery. Â But they made real sure those pesky Democrats didn’t screw it up:
The Dems moved to allow signs and cameras, in addition to guns, but this was voted down by the GOP members.
God bless the USA!
Andy
I don’t understand the objection to cameras, but considering the guns have to be concealed the parallel with signs doesn’t make sense.
And its not like the Dems are all about civil liberties anyway. They proposed those rules in attempt to block lawful concealed carry. Its not like they did it because they have any respect for freedom of speech.
MB
Andy, would you say that a defendant in a criminal trial has a right, under the Second Amendment, to sit at the defendant’s table in court, pistol at his side?
Andy
No, they don’t have that right. Neither do they have the right to protest or take pictures. But what exactly does that have to do with the subject of this post?
MB
Well, I needed to figure out whether you agreed that 2nd Amendment rights could be limited. You do. So the disagreement here isn’t really about whether there’s a 2nd Amendment right to carry guns onto the legislative floor, but rather the reasonableness of the restriction.
I think it’s utterly ridiculous to bring guns onto the floor (or into the gallery), in view of the possible harms. There are zero harms from cameras. And so long as a sign isn’t blocking anyone else in the gallery from seeing, no harms there (aside from hurt feeeeelings).
Andy
You are making an assumption that people somehow completely lose their mental faculties in the legislative chamber. You may have arrived at that notion given the utterly stupid legislation that gets churned out in this country. However, past predictions of blood in the streets and people having shootouts over parking spaces all the time, etc.. have not really panned out. So predicting that people will shoot each other on the house floor just because they are on the house floor seems to me to be making a rather large leap and assuming most legislators have no compunction about killing another human being. Again, I see how you got there; I just disagree.
MB
Andy
That’s one of the best arguments I’ve ever seen for abrogating the Constitutional rights of citizens. While we’re curtailing the freedoms of Americans based on weak stereotypes, ancient anecdotes, and no comparative statistical measurements, we should outlaw being gay since unwanted advances (i.e. sexual assaults) have been perpetrated by that minority of our society. After all, it must happen because how else would so many heterosexual men get that stereotype in their heads.
MB
Aww, Andy, you disappoint. I was expecting more humor out of you. Or at least a wailing about the inherent unfairness of me being able to include images when you weren’t (I was even kind of disappointed in myself, for that).
More seriously, you mistake my assumptions. I don’t think that legislators completely lose their mental faculties in a legislative chamber. At least no more so than do people in hospitals or schools, where I also think it completely appropriate to ban guns. In any event, we don’t have to go down to the Sumner Beatdown for an example of dangerous behavior by legislative inhabitants. Remember this idiot? How about this one?
Andy
Well, its pretty obvious that you are more interested in scoring partisan political points at the expense of civil rights than actually engaging in reasonable discourse. I’ll leave you with this: don’t expect other people to take concern for your rights seriously if you are not willing to reciprocate.
MB
Maybe that’s what you want to see, but it’s not my particular interest. Since I know you can read (and have been reading here, for some time), I don’t think you can fairly call me unconcerned about the 2nd Amendment (see, e.g., my posts on Heller). My mockery was aimed squarely at the Wisconsin GOP, who see some sort of 2nd Amendment interest in carrying guns onto the legislative floor while apparently ignoring the more obvious (and harmless) 1st Amendment concerns.